Ep 4: The Power of Raising Your Voice with Barb Collura
Fertility Forward Episode 4:
Today on the show we welcome Barb Collura. Barb serves as the President and CEO of RESOLVE, The National Infertility Association. Barb is a nationally recognized expert on infertility and the family-building journey, with a special emphasis on the personal experience of those struggling to build their family. She has worked for the World Health Organization on infertility definitions, and clinical guidelines worked with ACOG on their clinical definitions for infertility and served a four-year term on the advisory council of The National Institute of Child Health and Human Development at NHI.
Rena: Hi everyone! We are Rena and Dara and welcome to Fertility Forward. We are part of the wellness team at RMA of New York, a fertility clinic affiliated with Mount Sinai Hospital in New York City. Our Fertility Forward podcast brings together advice for medical professionals, mental health specialists, wellness experts, and patients because knowledge is power and you are your own best advocate.
Rena: Barbara Collura serves as the president and CEO of Resolve, the National Infertility Association. Barb is a nationally recognized expert on infertility in the family building journey, with a special emphasis on the personal experience of those struggling to build their family. She has worked with the World Health Organization on infertility definitions and clinical guidelines, worked with ACOG on their clinical definitions for infertility and served a four year term on the advisory council of the National Institute of Child Health and Human Development at NIH. A frequent guest speaker at medical conferences, Barb is an expert on public policy issues facing the infertility community that impact both patient access and clinical care. She has received the Distinguished Service Award from the American Society for Reproductive Medicine and is passionate about Resolves mission as the organization was a source of support and information during her own battle with infertility. In this episode, we talk about the power of advocacy and raising your voice. National Infertility Awareness Week and changing the stigma of infertility and how to get involved as an advocate. We're so excited to welcome to Fertility Forward today the amazing powerhouse, Barb Collura, who is the president and CEO of Resolve, the National Infertility Association. Barb, thank you so much for coming on today and giving us your time. I know you are so busy with so many things and we're so appreciative.
Barb Collura: I am so excited to be here Rena, thank you for having me
Rena: So, you know, for me, Resolve is really personal. It's how I started being very proactive and how you got involved during my own infertility journey and that's kind of how I discovered you. I was looking for an organization. How can I get involved? How can I start doing something to feel like I'm in control of at a time in my life that seemed very out of control. And that is how I came to you. So I would love for you to share with our listeners, what exactly is Resolve?
Barb Collura: First of all, I'm really glad to hear that we connected with you and that you found some comfort or resources or connection when you did find Resolve. That is really what we're all about. Resolve is what's called a patient advocacy organization. We were founded in 1974 and one of the main services that we provided in 1974 we still provide today, which are live in person support groups. Those occur all over the country. We have about 250 support groups that meet every single month, where people who are struggling to build a family facing infertility or other challenges are able to connect with others in person. So that's one of the core services that we provide. Resolve also founded something called National Infertility Awareness Week. It's the only federally recognized help observance for infertility that occurs in April, and it's an opportunity to educate the public about infertility and then we do other public awareness campaigns throughout the year, really looking at how do we ensure that the right information is getting out to the public about this disease about how different people build their families. Another important aspect of our mission is advocacy, and that could be legislated change. For example, getting state laws that might require insurance to cover IVF or fertility preservation. It might also be getting involved in legislation that might really harm our community. So we do that both in Washington, DC So what the federal level and also in state capitals around the country. And really, we do that through people like you, like we have people who come to Albany in an advocate in New York state and people come to Washington, DC to see them all over the country. So we are really focused on access to care. We also look at what employers are providing, so some employers are not covered by a state law. So what can employers be doing to provide a really great family friendly environment for their employees. So we get involved in public policy, public awareness, support and then, of course, patient education and connection. Whether that's through social media, connecting in our online support community or through our website. So we're laser focused, Rena, on people who are struggling to build their family, But we hope that that focus provides a very deep and rich connection and resources for people.
Rena: Wow, okay, so that is so much for one organization to do. And I have to say, and there's so much to touch upon and what you just said, you know, I think I met you for the first time when I went to Albany myself to advocate for insurance reform. And I remember going there and, you know, that was when I was just, you know, going through treatment myself. And I felt like, wow, this is so easy to go get involved, go meet with Senators and Congress. People in this organization makes everything so accessible and so I love that you give that to people and give them that opportunity. I think that's so powerful.
Barb Collura: Well, it's interesting that you said it that way because that's exactly how we feel. We feel that advocacy, citizen advocacy, raising your voice is actually quite simple. It's incredibly powerful. And it's not enough for me to go meet with every member of Congress or to go up to Albany. They don't care about me. They want to hear from you. They want to hear from their constituents. They want to hear from somebody who is going through this and has that story to tell. And what we try and do is exactly what you just said. We try and make it very accessible. So whether that's through training you, or providing you materials, or giving you your talking points. We try and make it, boil it down so that anyone could do this, that it's very accessible. And honestly, it's very selfish on Resolves part because we advance our agenda far more effectively when we get people to raise their voice and speak up. And, you know, look, this is hard to do when you're going through infertility. No one wants to talk about it to begin with, let alone go talk to their state legislator or their US Senator. I mean, that is very out of the box for most people. When they haven't even told their friends or family, so there's a lot for us to do and to encourage and bring along our constituents, so the easier that we can make it the better, because it's already just really hard stepping out of yourself and sharing your story.
Rena: Absolutely. And I think, you know, you said something that really resonated with me with something I learned along the way, which no one really says upfront, which is, you know, infertility is the disease, you know, it's one in eight, it’s so common. But as you said, so many people don't talk about it. And I actually did not know that Resolve that you guys were the ones that started National Infertility Awareness Week. I had no idea. I love that. It's one of my favorite weeks of the year just to be a big infertility nerd. I think that it's so important. You know, I wish that it was a month. I do. I wish it was a month. I wish it was, you know, bigger. I wish more people knew about it, and I, you know, my hope is that it grows on and there's more awareness because I think, you know, this is a disease, and it affects so many people and as you said, it's very hard for people to talk about it. You know, I myself spent the first year kind of living in darkness, and after a year I felt like, okay, I'm trying to create a life and I'm not living a life. And that's exactly when I started getting involved. And for me, that was a huge turning point.
Barb Collura: You know, when we think about National Infertility Awareness Week we for the for many years that we hosted, everyone looked to Resolve and said, okay, what are we doing for National Infertility Awareness Week? And it was very insular. I felt like we were because we haven't resolved now for 15 years. It’s like we're sort of talking to each other, and what we've now done is that it's your opportunity to kind of turn and talk to the world. So, for example, RMA of New York for you all to do whatever you could do in your own community about this disease, about raising awareness and, likewise, everybody across the country. So how are we talking to the media? How are we talking to people who don't know about us? It’s kind of interesting Rena what's happened with National Infertility Awareness Week a lot of people are using it now as like they're coming out week so you'll see people post on Facebook or post on Instagram for the very first time. I am going through this like I am now quote unquote coming out and letting everybody know what's been going on in my life. And wow, what a way to raise awareness and educate people by people sharing their own story and their own journey. And that's really what it’s about.
Rena: Oh, yeah, I think that's so powerful. And I think you know, there's so much fear with that goes into that, you know? But taking that step to kind of have, you know, they're coming out to say, hey, this is what I've been going through. This is what I'm dealing with. You know, I remember being there myself and then being so blown away and surprised by once I did that. You know, people that came out of the woodwork, the messages that I got through email, through social media, whatever about people saying, wow, I'm so proud of you. Thank you for sharing. You know, I went through this, or my friend went through this, or and I have never had anyone come back to me and say off. I regret you know, sharing this. Everyone I know has come back to me and said, oh my gosh, it feels like a weight lifted. I can't believe this person went through it, and that person. And how many people go through it. Why don't more people talk about this?
Barb Collura: And you know this likely relates to advocacies. So when I think about other diseases, other conditions that have really changed in my lifetime, you know you first think about breast cancer, you think about even AIDS, mental health, those things were not talked about. Those things were not shared, those things
Rena: Yeah, cancer was just the C word.
Barb Collura: Yeah. Yeah. And so I look at where those movements, where those causes are today. And let's be honest, they're not where they are today because everyone stayed silent. They're where they are today because people chose to speak up, people chose to raise their voice and what I tell people look, Resolve can do a lot but I'm not going to get us over the finish line if nobody speaks up. And for those that are brave enough to do, we need you. We need your voices. And if there's even more. We need everybody. And so while I respect the privacy and the pain that infertility brings, and I know that there's gonna be a lot of people who just are never going to be able to raise their voice, we need as many who can and are willing to do that because the status quo honestly stinks. And I don't think anyone is satisfied with the status quo with whether it's insurance coverage or whether it's getting access. And so if you look at New York State, you don't even you don't even have legal gestational surrogacy. And so thing is is that we need to reach our goals. We need more people raising their voice, sharing their story, educating others and that is when quite honestly, real change will happen. So it's all intertwined you know like you talked about people feeling, you know, really empowered by sharing their story. That's what's gonna, that's good and that’s what's gonna cause change to happen.
Rena: Absolutely. And I think you know, I think in recent years I don't know if it's because I've been more attuned to it just to get that my radar's up or or more, but I feel, you know, more public figures are sharing their stories. People are coming out there talking more about miscarriage, about loss, about you know how difficult it is to build a family. And any time you know, people often ask me, how do you feel about celebrities sharing their stories? And I say, you know, I love it because it gives it a voice. You know, it starts the dialogue, and I think the more dialogue that's out there, you know, the more of the conversation will change and we can get these insurance reforms. We can, you know, really change the voice and make this, you know a thing. And hopefully we'll have National Infertility Awareness Month. You know, everyone will know orange is the color you just have pink is for breast cancer. You know, the AIDS Walk in New York, huge events. You know, I hope that that is the future for infertility.
Barb Collura: Well, I hope that you're right. I mean, you know, it's our event, it's our week, so we can certainly do things to change it. We need everybody in the community doing something now for National Infertility Awareness week, and it's really been satisfying, I think, to see how major media outlets have picked up this year, in 2019 we had Good Morning America and the Today show both doing stories about infertility during that week and in some cases every day. I mean, that's pretty awesome.
Rena: That's amazing.
Barb Collura: It’s great to think about that. But you know, we have come a long way and you're right about celebrities and so forth, and I just want more real stories out there. It would be awesome if celebrities, maybe somewhere listening to this, would get involved with our public policy, our public awareness, those kinds of efforts. They can really make a difference in our goals and our efforts. But we have tried and we got them interested in our inner advocacy work. I will say that Andy Cohen got, has gotten very involved, and slated work in New York state around gestational surrogacy, and that's been incredibly helpful. But I think there are more and others that can get involved, and but you're right. Every time one of them even talks about it, it helps de-stigmatize infertility and it helps another person get closer to it. So yeah, it's, um, the power of community raising your voice. It's it's incredibly important.
Rena: So if any of our listeners listen to this now you are hearing this and say, ok, I want to get involved in National Infertility Awareness Week. How do you recommend they do that?
Barb Collura: We actually have a website just for National Infertility Awareness week. It's www.infertilityawareness.org and on that site, they have ways to get involved. How you can, um, do your own awareness once we have the theme figured out, which will be probably after the usually it's posted in January will be ways for you to download images. A lot of people download images on and put him on their social media, and then we have a lot of tips for how to share your story and what to do during that week. So it's both aimed at people who are going through infertility or who may be resolved there for infertility but wanted something as well as professionals, whether that's CEO or medical practices who want to do something. We have ideas and tools and resources on that website.
Rena: Okay, that's great. You know, with many things with Resolve it’s easy to do. And do you want to go back a little bit also and talk about the support groups? Because I know that's a big thing Resolve does and that's another way for people to connect and share stories. So I would love for you to tell our listeners about that as well.
Barb Collura: Well, there is, in fact, on that infertilityawareness.org site we usually have, a very easy way for people to share their story and to capture their story and then certainly reaching out to [email protected] you can email us and let us know what you're interested in and what really moves you like what? Or like wise, you know, what about your journey is kind of pissing you off and you want to do something about because I think a lot of times Rena advocacy comes from a place of being dissatisfied with, you know, the fact that your employer doesn't offer good benefits or, you know, insurance denied your, your coverage and so being able to kind of pinpoint where you know where your passion lies. We have a lot of people who run our support groups that maybe it's helping others. We have a lot of ways to get involved, certainly coming to Washington, DC is a big one. We have our federal advocacy day. It's usually in May, and it will be in 2020 and, uh, think about it. Think about making the trip and seeing what Resolve is all about, but also how you can get engaged. You know, one of the things that happens when people come to Washington as they sort of get the bug. They get the advocacy juices flowing and they get fired up and they want to do more. And so I think it's a very empowering community building day, but it's an opportunity for you to give back. You mentioned this earlier about just that loss of control. It really helps you feel more in control. So again, [email protected] and www.infertilityawareness.org is also a great resource.
Rena: Okay, and then so say someone does come to DC for the day. Can you kind of walk them through? What does that date look like?
Barb Collura: Yeah, so we provide training in advance, so we do a webinar training. We have a great website that has a lot of information. Some are videos, some are things that you can read. And then the day before you go up to Capitol Hill, we provide you with training. We started something called a new advocate training and it's usually about two hours, and you really get a feel for everything about, you know, how does Congress work? What's the day gonna be like, what are you gonna be talking about? How to tell your story, etcetera. You'll be grouped with people from your state. So every state has a state captain and there's a your estate delegation and you're with them people pretty much all day. We make all your congressional appointments. So on the actual advocacy day we meet in the morning. We have a good breakfast. We usually hear some inspirational speakers and we get a little bit more training and then you're paired up with your folks from your state and you head up to Capitol Hill. You meet with the offices of your two US Senators, and then you'll go over to the House side and you'll meet with your representative in the House of Representatives. And most likely you'll go to two or three of those meetings with fellow advocates from your state and the meetings last maybe 10 or 15 minutes and we give you talking points. We have specific legislation that were advocating for, and you meet with, usually a staffer, sometimes your member of Congress and you tell your story, we train you on how to run your meeting and then we all meet up. At the end of the day, we share stories and we kind of celebrate what happened. Uh, it's really empowering, and it's fun. It could be a little nerve racking for some people, but and then, of course, we have people who meet really well known member of Congress, you know, in the hallway, and they're taking selfies and do a lot on social media. People take photos of themselves all day and meeting with their legislators, and then they're posting, and, um, we have, like, 250 people that come and it's really really amazing day.
Rena: That's amazing. Definitely work hard but also some fun too.
Barb Collura: Yeah, exactly.
Rena: And is it ok do you think for people to come if they're not quite ready to tell their own personal story? But they're still able to come and advocate?
Barb Collura: Yes
Barb Collura: Yes, yes. In fact, when the state delegations all get together, you know, they kind of go through the group and say, alright, who's willing to share this story, who’s willing to share that. Who wants to talk? And it might be that that person that's not willing to, you know, not comfortable sharing their own personal story could just open and, you know, specifically talk about a legislation or who Resolve is or make the ask. They don't even need to tell their own personal story.
Rena: Okay, And what are your goals for 2020 advocacy day? What are you looking to accomplish next year?
Barb Collura: Well, 2020 will be the second year of the two year legislative session in Congress, so we have legislation that was introduced in 2019 that will really be pushing for in 2020 so none of that's going to change. We're looking to get IVF coverage for our veterans through the Veteran's Health System. We are looking for insurance coverage for federal employees, for active duty service members that there's a bill that would provide pretty expansive coverage. There's a second bill that specifically for the veterans and then we work on adoption issues. There is an adoption tax credit bill that we want past that will strengthen the current adoption tax credit. And so those are the the issues that I know we’ll be advocating for.
Rena: Okay, so those and those are very diverse, too. So for anyone thinking, oh, this is just about, you know, IVF or whatever it really you know, infertility covers so many bases in different subjects that really affect so many people from all walks of life.
Barb Collura: It does, it does. And I think that's what our legislators need to see because they don't know about it. They don't or they might have some preconceived notion, as we know that is way off base and seeing real people, their constituents, and then you know what happens. They realize wow my constituents care about this and I need to start paying attention to this, and that's what really makes a big difference.
Rena: Sure. And I think, you know, as we discussed, it's a disease. So it doesn't care how much money you have, what you look like, where you come from, doesn't matter, can infect anybody. And it does.
Barb Collura: Correct. And we need everybody there. And, you know, sometimes people bring a family member, maybe a sister or mom or best friend, and that's another really amazing thing to see. People come in there like I'm just you're supporting, I'm here to advocate, but I'm supporting my loved one. And that's another way that people can help you.
Rena: I love that. What a great form of support to really show someone that you care for because I think it does. You know, it affects the person going through it, and it does also affect their family members, loved ones, partners, etcetera.
Barb Collura: And I'm sure you hear it cause I heard it, you know, what can I do to help? And oftentimes we focus on the negatives. You know, people, people are asking me questions and they're ignorant and they're you know, vs finding ways that the people around you can help you and one of the ways is that they can come with the advocacy day and advocate.
Rena: I love that. I love that you touched on that because I, you know, as you said, my patients do. You know, my patients come to me all the time, you know this person is telling me to relax or whatever. And so I say, look, you need to give some tools for success. You know, you need to set them up for success and how to support you. You need to tell them what you need, and a lot of times, you know, it's work with a patient for them to come to a place to find out what they need. But as you said, I think it's giving people the tools and telling someone look, come with me to Advocacy Day is an amazing tool to show someone that you care or say I need the support. This is how you can support me.
Barb Collura: Yeah, exactly. And that's wonderful.
Rena: Do you also want to tell our listeners a little bit about the Resolve support groups? I would love for them to get some more info from you about that also, since that's another way to connect with people.
Barb Collura: So yeah, so go to www.resolve.org and right on our homepage there is information about support and getting involved in our support groups. You'll finally get to a page that is a map of the US you can type in your your city name, and a list will come up of all of the support groups that are near you. You could even put in your state. Let's say you live in Delaware or a smaller state you could just put in your state and all the support groups in that state would come up. So it's a really easy way for you to find out. And sometimes the support groups are topic oriented. Sometimes they're just general infertility. So all of that information will be listed. It will also tell you, like when during the month that support group meets and what part of town and then and how to get involved in how to contact. They're all free. There's no cost for peer lead support groups and you know, let's say you go to the site and you don't find one anywhere near you. But you feel like there's a need, contact us, and it may be that, you know, we have you start a support group. Don't worry. It's not a really scary thing, but, or it might be that we know of a couple of people in your community and you can meet up with them and get a group started. So www.resolve.org and look for the information on support groups.
Rena: Okay, that's great. And that's another really easy way to either get involved or another really easy way to go out there and find support. Find other people to feel connected. You know, I send all my patients to your website, and tell them, look on there. I love that you guys have that as a resource.
Barb Collura: Absolutely. And you know, people say the support group is what saved their life, connected them with others, gave them hope, kept them, you know, in medical treatment. It’s an incredible service. And like I said, we've been doing them since 1974 so they're definitely, and and here's the other thing people said, oh, support groups, you know, once the internet comes around, nobody will actually get out of their house and go to a live support group. Not true.
Rena: No, it's so powerful. Meet other people in person.
Barb Collura: Yeah. We continually grow our support groups. Our number of members continue to grow, so, yeah, you're absolutely right. That human connection is still really important.
Rena: I think some really powerful things happen in those groups. And, you know, I think this is often a unique shared connection you have with people. It's, ah, you know, connection you may not have wanted to share, but you do, you find other people going through it and it really kind of it doesn't matter if you're different in every other way under the sun. Going through infertility together is this unique common bond and a very, very powerful connection.
Barb Collura: Yeah, it just takes some guts. I get it. But I think what we hear is that once people connect, they really figure out the value of it and recognize the value of it. So, yeah, sometimes just got to give it a try. And you have a little courage and put yourself out there.
Rena: Yeah, and you can even go. You don't have to share anything at first, you can just listen. But I think going out there it's another way to be proactive and find what works for you in terms of building supports for yourself as you navigate this this journey.
Barb Collura: Wonderful. Yeah.
Rena: So before we wrap up, do you want to share our listeners anything else about Resolve? Any goals you have for the future? Where you see Resolve going? You've grown so much since you started, since you started there. So I’m very curious, you know, where do you see Resolve going in the next 5, 10 years?
Barb Collura: Oh, my. Well, I don't know if I can see. I hope I can see out 10 years. But our board and staff and volunteers are really laser focused on access to care. We just feel like there's too many people that are not getting the care they need. And we need to change that dynamic. It can't be done. Just one way has to be done multiple ways, so access to care. So people are listening to this and they think that paying out of pocket for all of this is, is outrageous. We agree. And so way also are looking at how do employers support their employees, who are doing an adoption and maybe who need gestational surrogacy and so things that maybe are not necessarily a medical health insurance issue but still have out of pocket costs and are still about family building? So that's an area that were really laser focused on. So I think from our perspective, if I could look back in five years and say, wow, we've helped, you know, a few 1,000,000 more people access because their employer now covers it, because states now require it, that would be incredibly satisfying and a kind of way to measure how we’re doing. So that's a big part. And I'll tell you, that's what our constituents tell us is the number one thing they want us working on. So, you know, people always talk about it, I wish you had a celebrity spokesperson. I wish you did this. So we should do that. Well, we asked our constituents, and they said the number one thing overwhelmingly was please get this covered by insurance.
Rena: Yeah, so I guess I am a constituent, and I agree. I mean, I got involved with you because I didn't have insurance coverage. So that was my driving force too. Absolutely and I, you know, continue to have patients and it breaks my heart to see people say they can't continue a treatment because they can't afford it.
Barb Collura: And that's right. And you know, it's a medical condition, and we need it to be a medically necessary, normal coverage. Look, I mean, I know a lot of people who, including family members who've gone through breast cancer, and I'm very, very happy that the reconstructive surgery was 100% covered by insurance. But you could argue that's not life saving. And you and I hear that all the time about infertility. Well, it's not lifesaving treatment. And yet how is it that a reconstructive surgery is completely covered? Because people advocated for it. They said this was not acceptable, and that's the kind of thing that we need to keep in mind when we're advocating.
Rena: Absolutely. And I think if no one would choose infertility, I certainly would not. It has certainly changed me personally and professionally and what I go back and make a choice to go through it. No way. It was the most difficult two years of my life, so as easy as we could make it for people and cover it, you know, no one shouldn't not be able to have a family because they can’t afford it.
Barb Collura: Exactly well and likewise, think about cancer patients who have who are facing a cancer diagnosis. Their insurance doesn't cover the freezing of egg and sperm beforehand, and they sometimes, they're deciding between medical treatment or future family. And that is really backwards. That is not acceptable at all. So there's still a lot. There's still a lot of work we have to do.
Rena: I will tell you I will definitely be at advocacy day in May, for sure. I hope some of our listeners that are hearing this will now be there, too. I think you know, you have done incredible work. There's so much work to be done. I think it's amazing that you know we have you. We have Resolve to do it. But as you said, you know it takes it certainly takes a community and there's so much change to work on which is exciting.
Barb Collura: Yeah, there's no, like I say, there's no shortage of things to do. And, you know, I'd love to work myself out of a job. So let's let's get to work.
Rena: Let’s put Barb retired on a golf course. So I like to end the podcasts by asking you to share a gratitude. You know, like to end on positivity. So one thing that you're grateful for today.
Barb Collura: Yeah, well, I, I'm gonna jump right on that. I am so grateful to the volunteers here in the Washington DC area who were involved with Resolve in the nineties because I found Resolve in 1999 and had they not been doing their thing and volunteering, I never would have found Resolve. I never would have never would be apparent and I wouldn't have this great organization as part of my life, and I actually I've gotten to know a couple of those people, and I'm so grateful, you know, you just don't know, Rena when you raise your hand and you volunteer, how that's gonna like what that ripple effect is, it might impact people that you're never ever gonna meet. But it's making such a difference. And so I'm incredibly grateful to those individuals because one side was, you know, going through my own journey. And I needed help. There were people there to help me.
Rena: I love that. I’m going to sit with that for a moment, but not too long since this is a podcast. Um, but I love that. And I think on the same vein, that's absolutely what I'm grateful for too. You know, at a time in my life, I did not know how it was gonna move forward and I felt like my life was on hold and everything was five steps forward and 20 steps back and I really didn't know I was gonna go on. I feel like Resolve, came in and kind of saved me and helped propel me forward. Gave me purpose when I was floundering. And so I'm so grateful that it was so easy to get involved in and with so many things to do and um so I'm very, very grateful.
Barb Collura: Well, I've got goose bumps, and I am happy we were here for you. And I'm so glad that you chose to have me as a guest and opportunity to share the work that we're doing and hopefully reach somebody who may need us or someone who can get involved.
Rena: Thank you so much for coming on. I so appreciate your time and your hard work. And, you know, I hope this. I'm sure this touched so many listeners and I hope this brings a lot more people to advocacy day this year and a lot more people who are you going to share their stories for National Infertility Awareness Week.I think everything is so powerful. So thank you so much.
Barb Collura: Thank you. Thank you for all you do. And again, thank you for having me on and for really championing the work that we do. I really appreciate it.
Dara: Thank you so much for listening today. And always remember, practice gratitude. Give a little love to someone else and yourself. And remember, you are not alone. Find us on Instagram @fertility_forward and if you're looking for more support, visit us at www.rmany.com and tune in next week for more Fertility Forward.